Comments on: Keltner List: Vince Carter

By: Michael E Sullivan

Michael E Sullivan — Fri, 08 Apr 2011 16:36:32 +0000

"Why are the 71 bucks totally forgotten" I wonder to what extent it's due to pissy old white guys who were bitter that Lew Alcindor became Kareem Abdul Jabbar?

By: Scott

Scott — Sun, 06 Jun 2010 03:10:18 +0000

I always enjoy reading these analysis. One guy who I was always very curious about was Sidney Moncrief. Little is mentioned about him in history, so I feel that could factor against him (despite the obvious lack of longevity). However, if you consider how WS48 ranks him and his defensive honors despite never finishing among the leaders in steals, blocks or rebounds; an argument could be made that he was the best player in the NBA the years before his injury in 1987 instead of Bird, Magic, Dr J, Moses or Kareem. I never saw him play, so if you could do a write up on "The Squid" that would be greatly appreciated. Here is a table I created to compare the top 8 players in WS48 from 1980 to 1986 (The first 7 years of Magic, Bird and Moncrief's careers):
Player HOF Years ORtg DRtg OWS48 DWS48 WS/48 All D 1st All D 2nd DPOY
Larry Bird Yes 7 114 100 0.120 0.090 0.21 0 3 0
Julius Erving Yes 7 113 102 0.113 0.078 0.191 0 0 0
Magic Johnson Yes 7 119 103 0.139 0.068 0.207 0 0 0
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar Yes 7 118 104 0.138 0.066 0.204 1 2 0
Moses Malone Yes 7 115 104 0.132 0.066 0.198 1 0 0
Sidney Moncrief No 7 120 104 0.139 0.066 0.205 4 1 2
Michael Jordan Yes 2 117 107 0.151 0.056 0.207 0 0 0
Adrian Dantley Yes 7 121 111 0.179 0.026 0.205 0 0 0

By: Bert

Bert — Mon, 31 May 2010 19:13:37 +0000

When did Vince Carter become a SG? Didn't he play most of his career at SF? Isn't that the position he should be compared with other players at? The Kobe vs. VC matchup was always disappointing because they didn't match up most of the time. Tell me I'm not making this up...

By: Jeff James

Jeff James — Thu, 29 Apr 2010 22:51:33 +0000

Kenwood said "I'd like to hear your take on Bill Bradley, whose numbers were worse than DJ's and he won fewer titles than DJ, yet managed to get in the Hall on the basis of playing in New York City. If there's such a Boston bias, explain that." KC Jones and Frank Ramsey had the All-Star Game occur during their entire career. Guess how many COMBINED times they were voted good enough to even be an All-Star, yet they're in the Hall.

By: Jeff James

Jeff James — Thu, 29 Apr 2010 17:29:15 +0000

How about Keltnering -
Jack Sikma
Larry Nance
Tom Chambers
Walter Davis?

By: sp6r=underrated

sp6r=underrated — Tue, 13 Apr 2010 15:38:43 +0000

I think the voters have really short-changed Manu over the years because of his mp. For about 30mpg he has played like a superstar since 2005.

By: Mike G

Mike G — Tue, 13 Apr 2010 15:18:15 +0000

Since 1997, Duncan has 7 of the top 100 Win Share regular seasons.
(Nowitzki has 8 of them, Garnett 7, Kobe and LeBron 6 each, nobody else more than 4)

In playoffs, Duncan owns 4 of the top 50 WS since '97 (along with Billups, Kobe, Shaq); including the biggest-ever, 5.9 WS in 2003.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/tiny.cgi?id=mUfYK

By: Romain

Romain — Tue, 13 Apr 2010 08:03:45 +0000

Off topic, but speaking of the Spurs' sustained excellence (#82), the Spurs have just won their 50th game of the season.
If you include the 1998-99 season when they went 37-13 (good for 61-21 over a full season), it is their 13th consecutive regular season with 50+ wins (starting with Duncan arrival in 1997), breaking the Lakers record from the Magic era (1979-80 through 1990-91).

What's amazing about this run is that they had very few great seasons from players other than Duncan:

In terms of All-Star:
D. Robinson in 1998, 1999 (had there been an ASG I think he would have been selected), 2000, 2001;
M. Ginobili in 2005;
T. Parker in 2006, 2007, 2009

In terms of All-NBA teams:
D. Robinson in 1998 (2nd), 2000 (3rd), 2001 (3rd)
M. Ginobili in 2008 (3rd)
T. Parker in 2009 (3rd)

By: Jason J

Jason J — Sun, 11 Apr 2010 01:22:18 +0000

People do know that players have roles that they are expected to play on teams, right? It's not some organized pick up game where you can just try to get to the line every time all by your lonesome to make sure that your TS% and PER stay as high as possible? Assuming DJ was asked to be a defensive stopper who get the ball to the best front line in NBA history possession after possession, and it led to 4 finals (and would have likely been more if Bird's back and McHale's foot hadn't both been ruined in '87)... I don't see the problem there. I'm with everyone on Moncrief though. How DJ or Dumars makes it ahead of Syd is totally beyond me. And don't get me started on Gilmore. It just shows again that voters value rings, the more the better. It'll be interesting to see how Rodman, Grant, and Horry are treated. I wish we had adjusted +/- going back to the very beginning, just for some kind numerical value we could place on helping a team win - even if it's a little sketchy as a measurement of the individual.

By: AYC

AYC — Sat, 10 Apr 2010 23:39:27 +0000

Elgin wasn't more efficient early in his career:

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/b/bayloel01.html

Besides the first couple years (1965-66)when he was hurt, Baylor shot better from the field in the latter part of his career.